Wikipedia talk:WikiProject China

HomeDiscussionMembers

Articles for Kangxi Radicals

I noticed that there is an article for each of the radicals in the Kangxi Dictionary, like Radical 62, Radical 25, etc. None of these articles contain more information than is already available in Wiktionary. Has it already been decided that these articles deserve to exist, or should we just delete them? These articles exist in a lot of other languages too. Kzyx (talk) 21:11, 6 October 2024 (UTC)

I personally don't think they should exist, no. Remsense ‥ 论 01:23, 7 October 2024 (UTC)

Kzyx, where are you finding e.g. Radical 62 at Wiktionary? There's no Wiktionary entry connected to the Wikidata item. Folly Mox (talk) 01:41, 7 October 2024 (UTC)

The "Translingual" section of the Wiktionary page for 戈. It mentions that 戈 is Kangxi radical #62, though it does not mention that it is Simplified Chinese indexing component. In any case, all of these articles only exist to provide those 2 facts, which we can easily add to Wiktionary. Kzyx (talk) 14:27, 7 October 2024 (UTC)

As a counterpoint that is admittedly WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS, we have articles for each letter of the alphabet and each Japanese kana, and so on. Based on the same logic we should be able to have articles for the building blocks of Chinese characters (since it is unfeasible to have an article for all Chinese characters). _dk (talk) 00:01, 8 October 2024 (UTC)

Yeah, but each letter of the alphabet and Japanese kana have a unique history to them, and some of these articles are quite extensive, like N (kana) and Q. In comparison, the Kangxi radicals don't have a unique history and there really isn't much to say about them. If the articles are kept, at the very least their names should be changed. Kzyx (talk) 04:30, 8 October 2024 (UTC)

Quite: I'm actually not sure if there's been significant diachronic analysis of radicals—e.g. identifying continuity of radicals in multiple epochal dictionaries over time—if there is, that would immediately make them having their own pages distinctly more reasonable, akin to having articles for letters or syllabograms. Remsense ‥ 论 04:36, 8 October 2024 (UTC)

I think each Kangxi radical does actually have a unique history, insofar as each is or was at one point a distinct standalone logogram. It would be nice if, in addition to the stats from the Kangxi dictionary, we could include information from Shuowen Jiezi and some modern unabridged character dictionary (which I'm astonished I can't remember any of; the highest profile modern dictionaries tend to be the more useful word dictionaries).

It might also be helpful to note (if not already present in the articles) which radicals have been merged in Simplified (Radical 162 does mention this; haven't checked the general case). Folly Mox (talk) 13:27, 8 October 2024 (UTC)

Some of these do not have a lot of information, but especially the Variant forms are useful and interesting encyclopaedic information, for example at Radical 162 where an (unsourced) section provides some history. I can see no particularly good reason to delete these articles, though. Merging is not a great looking option either; it seems more useful to keep the present way of organising things (and perhaps to think of things to add to these articles; for example, content about individual characters could be added to the radical articles). —Kusma (talk) 08:14, 8 October 2024 (UTC)

The section is uncited, but doesn't appear to be unsourced: the article includes two general references under the ==Literature== subheading, either of which seem plausible as a source of the section in question. Folly Mox (talk) 13:32, 8 October 2024 (UTC)

In theory, yes. In practice, checking the addition here we have that it is not in the source. (And not the other one either). Bumm13's original (fairly bare-bones) pages do seem to be sourced using general references as you correctly point out. —Kusma (talk) 13:46, 8 October 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for looking more deeply and correcting my misimpression! Folly Mox (talk) 20:40, 8 October 2024 (UTC)

If the articles aren't deleted, at the very least I think they should be renamed to something like Radical 戈 or 戈. Kzyx (talk) 04:24, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Korea-related articles has an RfC

Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Korea-related articles has an RfC for possible consensus. A discussion is taking place. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments on the discussion page. Thank you.

I'd like to hear from people who aren't necessarily experts in Korea or Korean history, but are familiar with Wikipedia style as a whole. This is a pretty major topic that would affect thousands of articles.

The topic is on what romanization system to use for Korean history articles. seefooddiet (talk) 21:52, 17 October 2024 (UTC)

Many new accounts appearing to work on China-related articles?

I am not sure what's going on here, and it seems to be specific to China-related articles, particularly Chinese history—参见．Treaty of Nanking. Manchukuo, Opium Wars. Some lone editors go for articles like Chiang Kai-shek, but it seems most common that in a short period of time, several polite, explanatory, but similar edits to the lead come together to the same article, each for a brand new account. The edits are always attempting to be constructive but unfortunately not really improvements so far as I've seen. They are usually unsourced and entirely redundant or misplaced. Then, they disappear after their one edit. Does anyone know if a school program is behind this, or what else it could be? Remsense ‥ 论 20:56, 19 October 2024 (UTC)

Oh no. Duh. It's a weird automated sockpuppet botnet of sorts, see Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Caoshuo. Remsense ‥ 论 01:43, 20 October 2024 (UTC)

Weird article name

Hsuan thu has quite an odd name. Should we change the article name to the pinyin name Xuan tu? Kzyx (talk) 04:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

It certainly is odd, but I'm more concerned that it may be incorrect. I'm not able to access any of the sources to check the transliteration (although the 1940 one is certain not to have used pinyin), but: the article doesn't exist at zh.wp or baidu, there is no mention of 絃圖 anywhere at zh:周髀算經, and every ghit I get is for 弦圖, i.e. chordal graph.

The feeling that I'm getting is that one or more of the sources cited by article creator Krishnachandranvn has mistaken a common noun used by later sources to describe this diagram as the Proper Name of the diagram, which applies to it and nothing else.

I'm prepared to forgive 絃 for 弦, since the two words have similar meanings (絃 is later), and there could very well be sources that use the term 絃圖 for chordal graphs.

Both Hsuan thu and Zhoubi Suanjing are short enough that the former could be merged into Zhoubi Suanjing § Contents, perhaps under its own lvl3 subheading. If we want to keep it as a standalone article, I'd prefer it at a name like Gougu theorem (currently a redirect to Pythagorean theorem) to avoid the common noun issue mentioned. The article has three mainspace inlinks, from Zhoubi Suanjing, Pythagorean theorem, and Bride's Chair. This may also be in play in this matter, but as mentioned I don't seem to have access to any of the sources (the Mathematics Magazine source cited, although hosted at Taylor Francis, is not accessible to the TWL account). Folly Mox (talk) 11:59, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Provincial infoboxes

I'd like to implement some decluttering in the infoboxes for Chinese provinces, possibly integrating the {{Infobox Chinese}} into it and removing most of the redundant parameters. Am I getting out ahead of my skis here? Remsense ‥ 论 19:02, 22 October 2024 (UTC)

Also, I'm curious if we can start phasing out the SVGs of characters, which I assume is there in case there wasn't any font support? Remsense ‥ 论 19:06, 22 October 2024 (UTC)

White whirlwind introduced many of the character images to {{Infobox Chinese}}. We had a discussion about it several years ago (I was against), but I can't find it now. Kanguole 19:31, 22 October 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for the context! I may go looking later. Remsense ‥ 论 19:48, 22 October 2024 (UTC)

The SVGs had dual rationales: One, I thought them aesthetically pleasing; two, they fix the problem of the huge discrepancies in how Chinese fonts are displayed across different browsers, operating systems, and devices. In all likelihood, they are best used only on articles whose titles are Chinese names or words. Kanguole is correct that he objected to them (here, I think) back when I first added them, but nobody joined him.  White Whirlwind  19:28, 23 October 2024 (UTC)

I am only trying to weigh the pros and cons given my experience with the articles in question here, thank you for the further explanation. Remsense ‥ 论 19:30, 23 October 2024 (UTC)

Semiconductor companies considered State-owned enterprises?

I've been making quite few articles on publicly listed Chinese semiconductor companies recently. I noticed many of them have China Integrated Circuit Industry Investment Fund investing in them. Or they are supported by government related entities like Chinese Academy of Sciences because they were originally projects that commercialized into full companies. Since they are now listed, government ownership for many of them is in the minority region.

So the question is do I just say these companies types are Public? Or do I have to also say they are also State-owned enterprises? Technically speaking many China publicly listed companies you will find some government related entity having a small ownership. But I don't know does that mean we have to go around putting the SOE label for almost everyone one of them. Imcdc Contact 03:12, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Even private corporations can have national or public entities as investors. I wouldn't consider them to be state-owned solely on that basis. CurryCity (talk) 12:14, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

I agree, a minority government stake doesn't make a company state-owned. —Mx. Granger (talk · contribs) 13:30, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Noodles

There is a discussion which may be of interests to members of this project. SerialNumber54129 13:02, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

Expelled members of the Chinese Communist Party category

In light of the ongoing anti-corruption campaign under Xi Jinping, many articles in the then-very large Expelled members of the Chinese Communist Party category have recently been diffused to yearly categories. However, there are a number of articles that could not be "dated" because there is no information on when they were expelled: they need information on when they were expelled, with reliable sources whenever possible. Also, some older expulsions may need to be combined into a category called "People expelled from the Chinese Communist Party before 1990" or something but I have trouble making {{Category series navigation}} detect the "cut-off" category. --Minoa (talk) 19:25, 3 November 2024 (UTC)

Discussion at Talk:EVE Energy § Article title

 You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:EVE Energy § Article title. -- Marchjuly (talk) 10:35, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

EVE Energy is a newly created article that needs to be assessed. Perhaps someone from this WikiProject could take a look at it, and also assess whether the article's title should be "EVE" or "Eve". It's possible that EVE is a translation of the company's Chinese name,but it's also possible that capitalization is just for stylistic reasons. -- Marchjuly (talk) 10:40, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

Chinese Buddhist history

Hi I am wanting to make contact with another editor that has a good understanding of Chinese Buddhism.🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼 Foristslow (talk) 02:38, 9 November 2024 (UTC)

Featured lists that need work to avoid removal nominations

Hello. I'm not a regular participant in this project, but I am a delegate at WP:FLC. I wanted to note that a couple featured lists I stumbled across don't meet our modern day requirements.

• List of emperors of the Han dynasty
• List of emperors of the Song dynasty

To be more specific, neither one is accessible (row and column scopes are a requirement at FLC now). I don't want to nominate these for featured list removal, as they're both part of featured topics, so I thought I'd bring it up here first as an opportunity for interested editors to make the relevant improvements. Hey man im josh (talk) 15:07, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

Oh, that's the intersection I'm the most qualified editor for. Will fix this up ASAP, thanks! Remsense ‥ 论 15:10, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

@Hey man im josh how do they look at present? I feel like I tackled major points but if there's anything else you're noticing LMK Remsense ‥ 论 04:04, 6 December 2024 (UTC)

Much better @Remsense. Improved enough I'm not going to be looking through them with a fine toothed comb :P Thank you for your work on these!

Though I do think the specifications for column lengths could be improved (in List of emperors of the Han dynasty), I'm not bothered enough by it to force the issue or anything. Hey man im josh (talk) 13:05, 6 December 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Tajiks of Xinjiang#Requested move 28 October 2024

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Tajiks of Xinjiang#Requested move 28 October 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Alpha3031 (t • c) 21:06, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

Xpost: image of characters in Infobox Chinese

Xposting discussion at Template talk:Infobox Chinese#Image of characters. This would affect a significant number of China-related articles, would appreciate input. seefooddiet (talk) 07:04, 28 November 2024 (UTC)

Can Controversy_over_Baidu be rescued or should it be deleted?

Since speedies/DRV don't registser well in the deletion discussion alerts, I'll link this discussion here. This is an article translated from zh wiki, speedied as an attack page and now being discussed at DRV (effectively a deletion discussion). _{Piotrus at Hanyang| reply here} 03:03, 3 December 2024 (UTC)

Chinese numbers for Prisoners of war in World War II

I am writing this; the source I am using, while recent and reliable, states that the number of Chinese POWs who died in WW2 are unknown. I assume this is a sad example of Western bias, as surely there should be some estimates for that from Chinese scholars?

If someone is interested in this topic area, note that we still do not have any article about Japanese war crimes against the POWs. I just finished one for the Germans, which also was missing... see the linked article for list of what we have. _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 01:54, 12 December 2024 (UTC)

Update: I have now created Allied prisoners of war in Japan. The best estimate for Chinese POW I have is "tens of thousands every year", with an unknown fatality rate outside the somewhat shocking statistics that only 56 Chinese POWs were released after Japan surrendered. Can anyone find anything better? _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 15:50, 12 December 2024 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Edu-Aid in YongNing

The article Edu-Aid in YongNing has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Unreferenced and unimproved for 15 years. No articles in Mandarin or other Chinese languages to expand. Run of the mill, very small charity. Not enough information to merge.

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Bearian (talk) 02:26, 12 December 2024 (UTC)